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Topic: Coach Boals

Topic: Coach Boals

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71 BOBCAT
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
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Coach Boals

Posted: 9/30/2023 9:24:57 AM

Is this Jeff's last contract year?

GO BOBCATS

Victory
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 9/30/2023 11:47:50 AM

71 BOBCAT wrote:

Is this Jeff's last contract year?

His initial contract was for 5-years. If it has never been extended than it ends on April 1.

SBH
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 9/30/2023 12:11:01 PM

It was extended after year 2.

M.D.W.S.T
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/2/2023 10:16:53 AM

I can't find anything about an extension, though I felt like there was one as well.

Obviously, Boals is very online, and appears to be pretty close with Julie - pretty shocked he hasn't been extended or is angling for one on the internet.

Little scary they're gonna go into 2023-2024 without a contract in place beyond 4/1. Especially since we're going to the Final Four on 4/6.

According to AN, OU's top earner was Boals at $699K. Would have to imagine an extension is topping $700-$800.

"Last year, Boals was paid $699,709 but this season he will be paid about $7,000 less at $692,000, according to Ohio University Spokesperson Carly Leatherwood. His compensation package breaks down to $592,000 base salary plus an additional $100,000 annual compensation � a total of $692,000."

Groce's extension into 29-30 has a salary of $650,000

For comparison, Nate Oates was making $837K before he left for Alabama.

https://www.athensnews.com/news/who-are-ou-s-top-earners/...

Last Edited: 10/2/2023 10:17:38 AM by M.D.W.S.T

Jeff McKinney
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/2/2023 12:48:26 PM

The Athens Messenger a few days ago published an article about the salaries of Ohio University officials, and in the headline named Coach Boals as the highest paid employee. As you might expect, this article has elicited the obligatory outrage from some in the Athens community, even though his salary has been published prior to this.

FearLeon
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/2/2023 3:37:09 PM

Jeff McKinney wrote:

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. He's been to the NCAA tournament once and he's going to get Ohio back there again. He's worth every penny.

The salary list of Ohio University employees is interesting. I will not share Russ Eisenstein's salary as it's easy to find. As has been discussed numerous times through the years, it's a number that after 17 years behind the mic is truly hard to believe...and I don't mean in a positive way. Stunningly low number. I give him credit for coming back year after year after year.

Last Edited: 10/2/2023 3:38:57 PM by FearLeon

#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

OhioCatFan
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/2/2023 3:54:00 PM

FearLeon wrote:

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. . . .

These are folks who think sports should be dropped entirely or be at the non-scholarship level. In their minds, this would make for more funding available for world religion studies, theatre arts, slime mold research, etc. [These are all useful endeavors, it's just that these folks have no idea how higher education funding actually works.]

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

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Pataskala
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/2/2023 6:23:08 PM

FearLeon wrote:

The salary list of Ohio University employees is interesting. I will not share Russ Eisenstein's salary as it's easy to find. As has been discussed numerous times through the years, it's a number that after 17 years behind the mic is truly hard to believe...and I don't mean in a positive way. Stunningly low number. I give him credit for coming back year after year after year.

Does Russ also receive compensation from IMG Sports? I forget the wording of the disclaimer that airs during broadcasts but I think it says something about IMG compensating the on-air announcers. That could help make up for a low salary from Ohio.

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

M.D.W.S.T
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/2/2023 8:03:25 PM

FearLeon wrote:

The salary list of Ohio University employees is interesting.

Frank still making $36K a year for fundraising and consulting duties.

What a weird number.

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/2/2023 9:38:43 PM

M.D.W.S.T wrote:

FearLeon wrote:

The salary list of Ohio University employees is interesting.

Frank still making $36K a year for fundraising and consulting duties.

What a weird number.

Bet it's the cost of a family healthcare plan.

Andrew Ruck
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/3/2023 8:12:45 AM

FearLeon wrote:

Jeff McKinney wrote:

As you might expect, this article has elicited the obligatory outrage from some in the Athens community, even though his salary has been published prior to this.

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. He's been to the NCAA tournament once and he's going to get Ohio back there again. He's worth every penny.

I would love to this discussion unfold in person. The outraged folks wouldn't even know what a tournament is. They don't like sports and are completely unable to wrap their mind around the value they provide to the university. They are people who think salaries should be about their personal perceived value of the work provided. Market factors, supply, revenue generation, etc. should not factor in at all for them.

Andrew Ruck
B.B.A. 2003

giacomo
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/3/2023 1:26:15 PM

Andrew Ruck wrote:

FearLeon wrote:

Jeff McKinney wrote:

As you might expect, this article has elicited the obligatory outrage from some in the Athens community, even though his salary has been published prior to this.

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. He's been to the NCAA tournament once and he's going to get Ohio back there again. He's worth every penny.

Well, if you're going to talk about the market for salaries, you must also talk about revenue. In this case, our athletic programs do not make money. At some P5 schools they do and maybe it's okay for a coach to be the highest paid employee at the university, but not at our level. I certainly think that athletics are a valuable part of the experience and for the town, but paying coaches in the dean range would be adequate in my opinion.

OUcat
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/3/2023 1:29:05 PM

Changing topics a bit ... anyone have news on the recruiting front???

Are the Bobcats close on anyone??

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/3/2023 1:40:53 PM

Andrew Ruck wrote:

FearLeon wrote:

Jeff McKinney wrote:

As you might expect, this article has elicited the obligatory outrage from some in the Athens community, even though his salary has been published prior to this.

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. He's been to the NCAA tournament once and he's going to get Ohio back there again. He's worth every penny.

I know about sport, market factors, supply, revenue generation, etc.

Can you justify Boals' salary using that insight? I struggle to, honestly. But there's data o don't have access to that you might. Curious to see how the numbers look.

I think it's tempting to create a strawman here and assume anybody who things Boals' salary is too high knows nothing about sports. But I think it's pretty reasonable to wonder what Ohio University in particular gains by paying Boals what we pay him.

For instance, on market factors: how do you define our market? Is it all of D1 basketball? Just our conference? Just mid-major schools? Just schools with similar basketball budgets? This list is dated by about three years, but why is Boals paid so much more than Groce or Miami's coach, and 2x some Conference USA teams? What market factor dictates that?

In the business world, you're typically advised to keep your payroll below 25% of your revenue. The latest revenue figure I could find for OU basketball was 2.8m a year. That means we pay a single person 25% of revenue. How does Groce, specifically, increase revenue. Is attendance up meaningfully? Is revenue?

Very curious because I've been wondering this for a while.

Edit: Found another source: https://www.midmajormadness.com/2018/6/11/17441968/ncaa-r... .

There seem to be a lot of schools who have substantially higher MBB revenue than us, with coaches paid substantially less. In fact, Boals' salary is a pretty big outlier in the market. Toledo's revenue is basically the same as ours, their coach made over 200k less. Rhode Island and George Mason have more revenue (by about 50%) -- Boals makes almost 2x what their coaches make.

Not sure I'm seeing the market forces/revenue argument here.

Last Edited: 10/3/2023 2:07:26 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame

ohiocatfan1
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/3/2023 3:51:47 PM

FearLeon wrote:

Jeff McKinney wrote:

Couldn't agree more. The number would shock most people.

TWT
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/3/2023 4:20:54 PM

OhioCatFan wrote:

FearLeon wrote:

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. . . .

Its debatable whether D1 athletics brings value or is a burden for alumni. One angle is every public university has a segment that wants to be FBS. Kennesaw State caved to the pressures and moved up to D1 and on to FBS. Is it a burden on alumni having to pay higher ticket prices for athletics and feeling pressure to support it? Are G5 athletics the happy medium where a universtity can be thought of as a real D1 school and not a low major without going all out on sports?

OU I think would love to have a name basketball and football team for publicity but in all due time and with private donations instead of the UC approach where it was fake it until you make it spend big in football/basketball for a long time and now they've arrived in the Big 12. One look at what UC is spending and Boal's salary by comparison is quite modest.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

giacomo
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/3/2023 7:25:13 PM

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:

Andrew Ruck wrote:

FearLeon wrote:

Jeff McKinney wrote:

As you might expect, this article has elicited the obligatory outrage from some in the Athens community, even though his salary has been published prior to this.

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. He's been to the NCAA tournament once and he's going to get Ohio back there again. He's worth every penny.

You make some very good points. For some on this board, it�s the Veblen effect. They get pride and satisfaction knowing our coaches are highly paid. It�s like buying a Rolex. It�s not worth it compared to other options, but everyone knows how much you paid.

Andrew Ruck
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 8:42:40 AM

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:

Andrew Ruck wrote:

FearLeon wrote:

Jeff McKinney wrote:

As you might expect, this article has elicited the obligatory outrage from some in the Athens community, even though his salary has been published prior to this.

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. He's been to the NCAA tournament once and he's going to get Ohio back there again. He's worth every penny.

I won't speak to Boals versus other coaches at comparable programs...my point was the concept of sports coaches being the highest paid employees at a college. It is very competitive and difficult to find the right person with the right experience and moxie to lead a D1 program to prominence. And in terms of value provided, looking at simply revenue generated is not enough. Literally the only alumni I know that have any connection at all to their alma mater are big Bobcat sports fans. A huge portion of the general awareness and image of the university comes from sports. One could argue the athletic department has 2 functions...1 the operations and revenue generation that we are arguing about and 2 a powerful marketing expense to the university.

On the flipside, I'm just not sure the same is true for talented and competent educational administrators.

Andrew Ruck
B.B.A. 2003

M.D.W.S.T
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 9:11:38 AM

Andrew Ruck wrote:

A huge portion of the general awareness and image of the university comes from sports. One could argue the athletic department has 2 functions...1 the operations and revenue generation that we are arguing about and 2 a powerful marketing expense to the university.

On the flipside, I'm just not sure the same is true for talented and competent educational administrators.

This part.

Sports exist as a tool of marketing to drive awareness, visibility, applications, as well as school pride and alumni engagement.

Sports are a recruiting tool as much as anything, and ideally you're recruiting current/future donations.

Teachers will never be paid as much, they're always poorly paid - its two different arguments, two different pools of money. Though many will group them. You're not paying Boals because he's a renowned geologist. You're paying Boals because he's gonna have OU on TV 25 times next season and hopefully drive campus engagement, alumni engagement, merch sales, pride and excitement on campus...

It's not fair, but does anyone think the guy who just won the Noble Prize at OSU should be paid more than Ryan Day? (He SHOULD, but you get my point) Most people won't remember his name by the end of the week. They will tell you the exact minute of kick-off though.

It is what it is.

TWT
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 9:54:38 AM

Andrew Ruck wrote:

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:

Andrew Ruck wrote:

FearLeon wrote:

Jeff McKinney wrote:

As you might expect, this article has elicited the obligatory outrage from some in the Athens community, even though his salary has been published prior to this.

I don't understand why Boals salary would elicit outrage from some folks. He's been to the NCAA tournament once and he's going to get Ohio back there again. He's worth every penny.

This argument doesn't apply to 100% of the university community, maybe half care at all about D1 athletics. That is reason enough to have it. Locally it brings in revenue to Athens and surrounding towns.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 10:20:57 AM

Andrew Ruck wrote:

We're in agreement that marketing is the primary function of athletics for the university. But marketing is a revenue generating activity, right?

To be clear, I only brought up "market factors" and "revenue generation" because you did first, as a means of explaining to people who think it's unreasonable that Boals is the highest paid employee at the University why it's not unreasonable. I brought up comps to other coaches/programs as a means of trying to understand what you mean by "market factors" and "revenue generation." The numbers don't seem to support Boals' salary, at least given my understanding of where our revenue sits relative to the rest of CBB programs and what the market seems to bear out for men's basketball coaches.

I get that there's very likely some invisible revenue created by D1 sports at OU. We know, for instance, that in the wake of our Sweet 16 run, applicants to OU increased. That's a clear line. There are probably many more less clear lines.

But there are an awful lot of D1 basketball programs at a comparable level to us, some who have had more success than us, who seem to find very capable, strong coaches for far less than we pay Jeff Boals.

I'm just curious as to why we think Boals in particular is worth that extra spend, and how the university benefits from it.

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 10:23:12 AM

M.D.W.S.T wrote:

Nobody is debating this basic point.

But shouldn't we be able to explain the thesis behind paying Boals more than most of his counterparts, and be able to roughly see the value he's creating from this marketing?

giacomo
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 3:28:57 PM

Sports are important, but it's important that we pay in line with our situation and reality. We could certainly set a reasonable number, say what a dean makes and we can find capable coaches in that range.

I looked up our home attendance numbers and we averaged 4,755 per game at the Convo last year. That doesn't sound like people are beating down the door. If you take Athens county population and surrounding counties, plus student population, that's not too impressive.

If and when we become the next Gonzaga and all the numbers go up, then having our coach being the highest paid may make some sense.

M.D.W.S.T
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 4:33:46 PM

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:

But shouldn't we be able to explain the thesis behind paying Boals more than most of his counterparts, and be able to roughly see the value he's creating from this marketing?

I mean, OU just had it's largest incoming class ever.

We could roughly start there.

giacomo wrote:

I looked up our home attendance numbers and we averaged 4,755 per game at the Convo last year. That doesn't sound like people are beating down the door. If you take Athens county population and surrounding counties, plus student population, that's not too impressive.

This attendance file I found from the NCAA says in 2022, OU averaged 5.7K in home attendance.

MAC average was 2.5K per game. Akron averaged 1.9K per game.

So OU is doubling the conference average. Tripling their rivals. That sounds pretty impressive to me.

�\_(;)_/�

Also, this file is super interesting. Has all teams, divisions, conferences.
http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_RB/2023/Attend...

Last Edited: 10/4/2023 4:46:40 PM by M.D.W.S.T

OhioCatFan
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RE: Coach Boals

Posted: 10/4/2023 6:42:27 PM

M.D.W.S.T wrote:

Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:

But shouldn't we be able to explain the thesis behind paying Boals more than most of his counterparts, and be able to roughly see the value he's creating from this marketing?

I mean, OU just had it's largest incoming class ever.

We could roughly start there.

giacomo wrote:

+1 Good points.

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